4 May 2014

How to Spot Fake SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 Crowns

When looking for the vintage SEIKO 6105-8110 or 6105-8119 automatic diver, an important thing to check is the crown. Some 6105-8110/8119 in the market have fake crowns. The water resistant quality of the fake crowns is unknown. Its internal geometry is also different. Most of the fake SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 crowns requires cutting off the tip of the original crown tube. So if you see a 6105-8110/8119 with fake crown, most probably the crown tube has been cut off or modified and the case becomes worthless piece of junk.

A simple way to spot fake SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 crowns is by counting number of crown "teeth" per section. The original 6105-8110/8119 crown has six groups of teeth. Each group has seven to eight teeth. While the fake one has only five teeth per group. See pictures below to see comparison between genuine and fake SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 crown.

▲ ORIGINAL SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 crown having seven teeth per group.

▲ GENUINE SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 crown having eight teeth per group.

FAKE SEIKO 6105-8110/8119 crown having five teeth per group.

Happy hunting and caveat emptor!

UDPATE 2014-05-04: SEIKO 6105-811x crown with 6 ribs per group

Lately I saw some original 6105-8110 and 6105-8119 crown with 6 teeth per group. Probably this is from early production batches of 6105-811x (1970 to mid 1970s). Below are two pictures submitted by Kevin a member of watchuseek.com forum which I have enlarged and edited for clarity. The watch is a SEIKO 6105-8119 from April 1973. The crown has 6 ribs per group.



SOLD: Original second hand for SEIKO 6105-811x automatic diver


For sale is original second hand for vintage SEIKO 6105-811x automatic diver. Overall length is approximately 16 mm. It is an old stock and has never been installed on any watch before. Condition is shown in pics below.

Price: SOLD shipped via registered mail.








7 Jul 2013

SOLD: KING SEIKO 4402-8000 (September 1966)


Up for sale is my KING SEIKO 4402-8000.

Production date: September 1966.
Case dimension:
  • Width: 35 mm (excludes crown).
  • Thickness: 11.5 mm.
  • Lug: 18 mm.
Description:
All original.
There is scratch on dial. But overall, dial and hands are in fair condition.
Case and case back is in fair condition and untouched. There is a small dent on 1:00 o'clock lug. The KS gold medallion on the caseback is nice and clean. This is early 4402-8000 model with KS Shield medallion.
Movement and quick-set date setting mechanism are working well. Movement was completely overhauled by SEIKO service center on May 2012. Accuracy is within +/- 10 second/day.
Original crystal has scratches.
All new gaskets (crown and case back).
Not water-pressure tested.
Comes with used 18/16 brown leather strap.
Price: SOLD. FREE shipping with insurance in Indonesia.












▲ Details of dial text.


▲ KING SEIKO Shield Medallion. This type of gold medallion can only be found in early batches of 44KS, up to year 1966/67. The gold medallion is in nice and clean condition.


▲ 4402A movement is nice and clean. This 44KS movement is the first movement in the world which use a rare adjustment technique by attaching counterweight to the hair spring. AFAIK, there are only two movements that using this technique: SEIKO 44KS and SEIKO 4S79 Chronometer (limited to only 500 pieces). Below is excerpt from interview with Akira Ohira, father of modern mechanical Grand Seiko, nicknamed "God of Adjustment":
"... Like 44KS caliber, I attached a weight on the hair spring to eliminate the position error. It is not a well known method, and those street watchmakers who don't know well tend to think it is "dust" and take it away and ruin everything. I even picked the glue by calling Locktite telling the requirement and they brought a few samples. Even though I assembled and adjusted the watch, I am looking for it in the secondary market but I have never seen it. 
Anyway, the idea of weight on the hair spring was on SEIKO's in-house text book - the accumulation of the SEIKO know-how book. It works, but it was actually implemented only on 44KS and 4S79. By the way, GS does not use Breguet spring, but flat spring - this is based on the actual comparison data, believe or not...."
Source: Interview with Akira Ohira - Watchmaking "Father" of Modern Mechanical Grand Seiko


▲ All new gasket (crown and case back). Watch is safe and water resistant for daily wear.



SOLD: KING SEIKO 5625-7000 (April 1969)


Up for sale is my KING SEIKO 5625-7000.

Production date: April 1969.
Case dimension:
  • Width: 37 mm (excludes crown).
  • Thickness: 10.5 mm.
  • Lug: 18 mm.
Description:
All original.
Small blemish on dial's edge. But overall, dial and hands are in nice and good condition.
Monocoque case is in good condition and untouched. The KS gold medallion on the caseback is nice and clean.
Movement and quick-set date setting mechanism are working well. Movement was completely overhauled by SEIKO service center on December 2012. Accuracy is around -5 second/day.
Crystal has been replaced with NOS (New Old Stock) SEIKO OEM crystal during overhaul.
All new gaskets (crystal and crown).
Not water-pressure tested.
Comes with used 18/16 brown leather strap.
Price: SOLD. FREE shipping with insurance in Indonesia.













▲ The case is a robust 1-piece construction (monocoque), complete with soft iron cover on the caseback for anti-magnetic protection.


▲ The caliber 5625A beats at 28,800 bph which is considered hi-beat in its era (late 1960s).


▲ Movement is nice and clean.


▲ This is one of the early 56KS movements with special external regulation feature. On the side case between lower lugs, there is an External Screw which covers the access hole to the external regulator mechanism. User can regulate the movement by inserting a small slotted screwdriver (around 0.8 - 0.9 mm) into the access hole and turn the regulator lever.


▲ The early monocoque 7000 model has unique case design. The lug is shaped like a tip of Katana sword with wide mirror-polished surface for optimum reflection of light. ▼



▲ All new gasket. Watch is safe and water resistant for daily wear.